The tough part about parents that are saying "I give-up" are the hardest to "sell" on the idea that you really do need their input etc. Our entire group of parents that became regulars to our meetings have been inour school for awhile but it wasn't until this year's Prez served last year many came aboard.

Would it help to meet with your Principal to discuss the ideas you do have and ask her about what she has planned? I guess I still have an issue with her statement about not knowing why you are all at the school....volunteering or getting kids or touching base with someone it still bothersome to think she believes you are just there because you have nothing better to do! Not that I am suggesting you need to check in with HER but that she has an active team of volunteers wanting to make her school an even better school.

Orientation Day will be an important day for you aslong as you can have a space at school to talk to parents and share ideas. Kidda a meet'n'greet Meg! You are a fresh face and this would be a great way to get your face out there! Share with parents the ideas that you and the principal have worked on, what areas the PTO can use parent talents, phone numbers (e-mail addresses work awsome!) and SMILE!! You can do this!!

Thank you ...Thank you...Thank you for the advice. I have checked our by-laws which mention nothing about the PTO having an account or turning it into the school. I have learned through our central office that all of our City School's PTO accounts are held by the central office. But, they claimed there was no one in the office that could tell me whether or not that was a requirement.

I did manage to speak to an officer from one of the other schools and was told that it was a give and take with their principal. They always knew how much is in their account and able to spend money on their own programs. It is not that I want control of the bank account. I just want to get a portion of the decision making control back for the parents in an effort to show them their opinion counts. Then maybe some of them will come back to the PTO. When the average parent's opinion is why should I help? Those people up there just want money and more money and we get nothing back directly for our kids! What does that say to our kids about the school? If parent morale is low that must effect the kids opinion. Our children get a good education and have many advantages that children in other schools in our state do not have. But I do not think that making the parents feel welcome in the school and that their opinions are appreciated is going to have a negative effect on that. Now, how to make that happen, I haven't quiet figured that out. Most parents have developed an "I give up... I just do not care attitude". To bring about change you need some support or you are just that lone nut causing problems. Those that do voice their desire for change, are unwilling to voice it to administration for fear of rocking the boat. I have not given up yet! Wish me luck!

okay, I am at one of those wacky schools where this idea works of our money held in an account with the school. To pull away from this is NOT EASY! OTHERS HAVE TRIED! I don't want to burst any bubbles but like Tim said this will take time.
Now a few years ago the school district offered an oppurtunity for other PTO Presidents to meet and talk (we have 12 elementry, 3-4 middle, and 3 high school- I think) and the gal I know that went had a great time and learned so much! They did agree about the money/account issue it would be nice to have our own account.
I'm not an expert on by-laws but I don't think they can be "just amended" because someone "felt like it" Okay, skimming my Roberts' Rules, changes are really suppose to be put to a vote by the membership. I know, easier said than done.

I really like the idea of talking to the other parents in the district, someone many even have names of people you can talk to about your Principal (like her boss!).

Just remember by doing what you can is doing more than most people even think about.

Hello,

I have found myself in the same situation, and it does take time. I have posted other messages under "Wave Maker" that you might find helpful. Two years ago the entire PTO board at our school quit. They did not come back, and they did not leave one piece of paper as a guideline for the upcoming PTO board members. No by-laws, nothing. They were facing the same type of principal. They wanted to teach her a lesson in appreciating what she had with the parent volunteers. I felt that the lesson needed to be taught, but not at the expense of the teachers and children. So, I was one of the people that took charge of the board this year. There was 10 of us at the beginning of the year, and by the end the principal chased off all but three of us. The three of us were determined. It is my belief that I pay taxes and I pay that principal's salary, so she works for me. I am not a trouble maker, but when it comes to my children I will defend them in every sense of the word. I really believe that sticking in there and fighting (which it was a fight) is in the best interest of the school, therefore in the best interest of my child. When I say "fighting", remember to be adults. You can have disagreements and discusions, but do not let it get ugly. You loose all credibility when that happens. The three determined members that were left on our board last year wanted to leave a mark for next years board. We made sure that we had a completed by-laws, we put some new fund raisers in place, were able to get a few of the school fund raisers out of the principals spending hands (school store, pictures, etc), put out a parent/teacher survey, elected a new board for the upcoming year (where I was voted in as president), and arranged for meetings. We did all of this with her resisting tooth and nail. What is the worst thing that is going to happen? Will she be able to kick you off the board? Not likely. You have a lot of support from others that want to challange the system, but do not have the courage to do so. The lack of courage might come from the way they believe their children might be treated. Since I was in the school almost everyday this year as a volunteer or sub. teacher, I spoke with teachers about that fear. They told me that they are the ones that will be with my children, and they are not going to treat them any different. They also told me that the only time the principal would have anything to do with the kids one on one is if there is a discipline problem. There never has been, and if there ever was I better be called. This year as president, I have big plans to get the parents involved. John Hopkins University did a 10 year study on community involvement with every child's education. This study proved the improvement in GPAs because of the community involvement. I am using this study as my grounds for the involvement this year. The principal has said the same words to me, "if you want to beat your head against the wall, go ahead". The fact is that I've spoken with the parents in my school. They feel unwelcomed to volunteer and get involved. They felt that in past years you had to part of the "in group" in order to volunteer, and they felt that the principal was too involved with every decision. That she has too much "say so", and that she was going to do what she wanted no matter what. That was true, but this year we have 10 strong people that will not take that from her. They will not allow themselves or their children to be steam rolled. The best advice I have is to search your heart. Make sure your decisions are in the best interest of the school and that none of them have your own agenda in mind. Make sure you go in with the understanding that not every idea is going to be excepted, and do not let that discourage you from the next idea. Have a treasurer in your group (we will have one this year for the first time). Make sure that person is not "mousey". She will need to not be afraid to ask for the records, and almost demand (in a nice way) to see those records. She will need to be able to help the school book keeper. Little by little responsibilities will shift your way. But, be careful what you wish for. You might find it all coming your way. Make sure you have the people and by-laws in place to handle whatever comes your way. Look through this website to find by-laws. Edit them, put in what works at your school, take out what does not, present it to the board and principal for approvement, edit again according to what others have to say and what has been voted on, and then go from there. You will have something in writing that the principal has agreed to. Make sure to give a deadline for returning the by-laws. After that deadline the by-laws stand as they are. One last thing to remember, everyone has a boss. It is your right to go through the chain of command. If you have given a serious effort with your principal and have gotten no where, go over her head. I hope this helps and sorry it is so long.

Once again thank you so much for the advice. We do not have a Tax ID number. I have poured over our by-laws and I have a question. Our by-laws are approx. 9 or 10 yrs. old. Since they were written we have changed our name. We did not combine with any other school. Are these by-laws still valid? If valid, our by-laws contain a list of officer responsibilities. Our principal has revised those responsibilities and given me a copy. Can she do that?
In response to Critter..........I am torn. I am one of these people who can't sleep at night if something I am in charge of isn't running smoothly. If I accept a project I am incapable of giving it less than 120%. When approached about this I said that I would be very active and was willing to be an officer but due to the fact I had a child starting Kindergarten this year I felt I could not be president. Well a few months later I was introduced to the principal as next years PTO President. I really thought it through and decided that I could make a difference and I could balance this position and my youngest child's school. I got very enthusiastic about increasing programs other than fundraising and fundraising. To me a strong PTO is an asset to a principl and the school and strong is not defined only by its fundraising total. I was ready and willing to go the extra mile. I feel that a PTO should do the things you guys talk about on this wedsite for the kids and to icrease parent involvement. Historically, we do nothing free for the children themselves. Every activity that the PTO provides at school but one we charge for. Other PTOs are sponsoring family nights and parties for the kids. We are only selling things to our kids to earn more money.

I think that the school holding a PTO account is not necessarily a bad thing. My initial thought was great there will never be a question to where the money went. But, NO I do not think that the money our parents and children go out and raise should be an extention of their yearly income. I think the parents deserve a say with the principal request usually being the first priority. So after all of this rambling my answer is I don't know if I am up to the fight. If I felt that the current state of parent interest and morale would be raised enough that this grassroots effort would continue the following year when I am gone... Yes, no question I can take the heat. But right now the large majority of parents run from the PTO because they want money, time and more money and time and no one cares what they want and think. Nothing is given directly back to the children. Therefore, the parents are not going to believe me until I show a difference and I don't know how I can influence the principal without a more support than the officers. How do I make this happen?